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Дж.Д.Селинджер


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Тему о Сэлинджере я уже открывала. Вот здесь http://forum.hayastan.com/index.php?showtopic=5141

Что касается смерти Тедди - наверное, он просто уже выполнил свою миссию в этой жизни и ему надо было уйти.

А самоубийство Симора на мой взгляд было его единственной слабостью... Человек имеет право на слабость, не так ли? Как и право на ошибку.

Da perechital ya tam vse vashi emotions, no dumau tema sebya ne ischerpala.

Ya sklonen schitat' samoubiistvo ne slabostyu, a znakom ogromnoi voly, Pobedi nad jivotnim instinktom boyazni smerty!!!

Da i krome togo nelzya ideficirovat' tvorchestvo Selinjera, kak suitsidalnoe.

Ya, lichno, jizn' i ludei, nas okrujayushikh, bolshe vzlubil posle ego rasskazov!!!

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V raskazakh Selinjera geroi vse yarkie i v chem-to osobennie ludi. No chto-to mne za vsyu moyu nedolguyu istoiyu jizni ne povelos' uvidet' pokhojikh na nikh lyudei. A kak dumaete, oni real'ni?

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Es uzumem haskanal, menk batsy Saroyanits Arevmutkum tchanatsvadz mets grogh 20ort dary unenk?

Artsek menk karoghenk hbartanal Russneri, Amerikatsinery, Argentinatsinery, Anglyatsinerypes havasar mer verchy serunty groghnerov?????

Artsek menk chenk teragnahatum mez u mer hnaravorutyunner@. Artsek menk piti gorank vor menk mekhkenk, vorovhetev 1915 tvakanin....??????

P.S. Ara Biliozyani kardzik@ indz haskanalie, na uzume gre ain inch michev nran grats chi eghel hai graganutyan mech, hashvi charnelov patmakan irakanutyun. Erevi mekm nran neghatsrele vakhtin (Asumen Hitlernel Hitler cher lini ete pokr vakht@ bagi erekhaner@ amenor ch@ tsedzein

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Es uzumem haskanal, menk batsy Saroyanits Arevmutkum tchanatsvadz mets grogh 20ort dary unenk?

Artsek menk karoghenk hbartanal Russneri, Amerikatsinery, Argentinatsinery, Anglyatsinerypes havasar mer verchy serunty groghnerov?????

Зависит от того, кого ты считеашь армянским писателем: на основании крови, или, скажем, того, что тот или другой признает себя армянином/армянкой...

20-я век: Сароян, Азнавур, Анри Труая, Грант Матевосян, Агасси Айвазян. Наверное все. :unsure:

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Pravilno li bit' ne sentimental'nim, 'zaranee zagotovlenime chuvstvami' na opredelennie situatsii? Pochemu nel'zya prosto bez etogo pafosa jit'. Vseravno nichego ne vechno, daje lubov' na sed'mom nebe... K chemu vse eto?

(tema kstaty u Selinjera proslejivaetsa)

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Ok. Chachanak.

Indz hangist chi talis mi harts. Orinak duk vor girknek hamarum lav@, vor andzne dzer hamar lav. Kinonkar naheluts vor kinone dzer hamar hajoghak kino? Inchne dzer gnahatich@.

Kan kardzikner vor ete kinon artasume martun uremn lav kinoe....

Baits es hamozvadzem vor da sintementalnost'e vochte irakan gnahatelu michots. Che vor irakanutyun@ aveli bonalniee(trial) kan mer hivandagin fantaziyaner@(bolnoe voobrajenie).

Menk geratenumenk tsutsadrakan mer zgatsmunkner@ prel urishnery hayatskin, lav kam vat aritov. Isk voch mi mart chi mtadze, orinak en knikner@, kam tghamartik vor taghman@ anbnakan gorumen, kgorain ete irants tesnogh publikan chkanar?

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Ok. Chachanak.

Indz hangist chi talis mi harts. Orinak duk vor girknek hamarum lav@, vor andzne dzer hamar lav. Kinonkar naheluts vor kinone dzer hamar hajoghak kino? Inchne dzer gnahatich@.

Kan kardzikner vor ete kinon artasume martun uremn lav kinoe....

Baits es hamozvadzem vor da sintementalnost'e vochte irakan gnahatelu michots. Che vor irakanutyun@ aveli bonalniee(trial) kan mer hivandagin fantaziyaner@(balnoe voobrajenie).

Menk geratenumenk tsutsadrakan mer zgatsmunkner@ prel urishnery hayatskin, lav kam vat aritov. Isk voch mi mart chi mtadze, orinak en knikner@, kam tghamartik vor taghman@ anbnakan gorumen, kgorain ete irants tesnogh publikan chkanar?

:) :) :)

Shat hetakrkir harc e, bayts shat djvar klini grelov patasxanel u vorosh baner kam chisht chen haskatcvi, kam kisat kmnan. Bayts, vochinch kpordzem im mtkern el artahaytel. (greluts lav chem ;) yes kasei shaaaat vat em ).

Amenashat@ ais kyankum indz dur chi galis orinachaputyun@ (chnayats, vor krtutyuns texnikakan e).

Grker, kinoner, yerger... drancic indz hamar lavn en, nrank, voroncum yes karox em gtnel "communication". Aisinkn, yes (mnalov chachanak, voch te nor andz), darnum em, et kino-i kam grki mi URISH heros (voch te arden gtnvox herosneric mek@). Vortex karox em nranc kam hexinaki het zrucel, vichel, @ndunel, zarmanal, yev ailn.

Orinak detektiv grker@ indz yerbek chen dzgel, vorovhetev mi kani hat kardaluc heto, formulan arden parz e darnum u im hetakrkrutyun@ shat shut korum e, orinachaputyan patcharov.

Yes im glxum mi kino unem (im sepakan :p ), vor arden mi kani tari e qarsh em talis hets, nuinisk gitem, te vor kadrum inch yerajshtutyun e linelu. Bayts der chi hasunatsel ain astichani, vor durs prtsni. Inchi em sa asum? Kardum em greker inchpes nkarahanel, poqr, andznakan filmer. U drancic mekum batstarum en Hollywood-i "3 act" formulaov nkarahanvox filmer@, yev inchpes dranc CHhetevel. Bayts patkeratsrek, vor aid formulaov stextsvats filmer@ amena shat sirvats en kino siroxneri koxmic :down: Apsos...

Artasvel stipox kinoner@ chem hamarum ujex, amen a hesht ban@ ashxarhum mardkanc latsatsneln e ;) . Hrapurel, hamozel, ankexts ZRUCEL, "remote", unkndirneri het, hamarum em shat ujex hatkutyun. Ain filmer@, voronk vor karox es ditel "over and over and over again" lav zrucakicner en, mez shat srtamot mardkanc het, menk hachax enk nuin temaov 100 angam xosum, bayst urish angamner mez chhetakrkrox mardkanc karox enk asel "De et masin arden xosel enk".

Lav mard... :hm: im kartsikov...yes lav mardkanc chem karox nkaragrel. Kan shat lav mardik shat vat hatkutyunnerov, henc drank indz hamar lavn en (sxal mi haskacek :)) Azat mardik, azat... nkati chunem en azatutyn@ vor "Uzum em mazers kanach em nerkum, kam uzum em patrvats shorer em hagnum", che!!! Azat nkati unem azat mtatsox mard, spitak matsuni mej sev sherter tesnox mard. Che, chem karox...batsatrel, chi statsvum

Bayts indz chen gravum hasarakutyan koxmic "LAV" shtamp statsats mardik.

Chisht mardik... Yerkushabti-Urbat, heto Weekend formulaov aprox mardik.

"Senc petk a lini, senc chi kareli" mardik. Chem asum, vor irenk vatn en, bayts akama irenk darnum en ambox :unsure:

Taxumnerom goracox mardkanc masin chishtn asats chei mtatsel, es el chgitem grelov inchpes artahaitel, bayts indz tvum em, vor aidpisi mardik pordzum en irenc "unkndirnerin" tsuits tal irenc zgatsmunkneri xorutyn@, irenc anzorutyun@ brnkvats ed patos-i dem, bayts chjxtelov irenc apratc voxbergutyun@ khamardzakvem asel, vor mi gutse aid zgatsmunkner@ bavakanin makardakain en, ain arumov, vor angitakcoren, nrank poxadrum en amboxj "drama-n" irenc vra. Darnum en et "kino-i" glxavor herosner@. Yes shat neroxutyun em xndrum cinizm-i hamar, bayts sa abstract xosakcutyun e, aid mardkanc chem qnnadatum.

Mi artahaytutyn ka "Read between the lines" ;)

Vai, kani es amboxj annormal posting@ chem jnjel, sexmum em "Add Reply" :)

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Tisht asats grumem vraz u voch harmar jamanak, baits 'kaidz arats :wow: ' ko gradzits dear Chachanak chem karogh hakhtel temptation of writing.

Im kardzikov amen hokevor,imastun mart uni ira kinon,ira siradz kyanki erk@ u amen ankam erb martu glkhovor tsangutyunner@ ((kusht linel@...)bavararvadze-mojesh opratestovat') na mtadzume ira kinoi masin :hm: . grumem sa vorovhetev im kinon arten es shatem erke u tese u ete astvats lini blagosklonii :hehe: es kiirakaтуtsnem na. Kuzenai asei inchu het hamadzain chem, baits du karas ases vor 'read between lines'. dra hamar hatuk kgrem mi pokr ush.

Hokerazat mart unenal2 karoghe aveli ujegh okut ta kan harstutyunner. Es irok chei mtadze dra masin, baits ko greluts heto nkaty vor menk zrutsumenk harazati het jamerov u misht ka khosalu ban, ankam jamerov hnaravore lrel u dael klini mets zruyts...

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Davai pishi, mne toje ochen interesno znat' v chem ty ne soglasen ;)

Djvare artaratsnel spasmunkner@ erb kezanits patrasten lsel mets kaidzaknain mi mitk kam arachargutyun, so

1. Chachanak shat hetakrkire dzer kinon inch voj uni, vor nra mech chka

vstuplenie

sobitie

razvyazka

Chlini Tarkovsku,Salvador Dalii kam Parajanovi nman enigmatic tesankar unek dzer plannerum?

Es lriv haskatsa duk inchek uzetsel asel u hargavor cher amen parz mtkits heto grel-tchisht haskatsek...

Literaturan(graganutyun@) shat lain ararkae vor asel, gtnelov orinak detektivnery formulan, da tupikovi ughutyun e, kan shark "detektivner" vor djvare ankam asel detektiv, aveli shut psikhologicheski besstseler u nrank kartalov djvare tesnel formulai nerkautyun.

Orinachaputyun@ mi pokr sur ek @ntunum, kani vor hajakhaki handipumen martik, Lav martik vor dzer asatsy pes azaten, baits der ujegh chen dimatrel @ntunvats stereopipnerin. Aid pes martik skzbits spasumen chapahasutyan@ vorpesy mi pokr ankakhutyun dzer beren tsnoghnerits heto nrank aprumen tsnoghneri nakhatesats nrants hamar kyanki hatvats, amen rope chmoranalov vor na azate u Lavne.

@ntanrapes tsnoghneri nakhtesats kyanky hatvadze prdzume institut avarteluts heto,

Baits

-Artsek aid tariner@ chkodretsin azatamtutyun@ u lain mtki asparez? Aveli shut ayo, kan voch, kani vor kutakvats azatutyun@ mokhranum iz-za sueti suet-Grekh veliki

-Na heranume stipats orenknerits, apagaits u durse talis amen lav@ inch kutakveler mech@.

Verchapes kareli asel kharizmaticheski martik kan unorinachap

Baits hamenaindeps unorinachap martkants mech medzamasnutyun@ delitant en, aisinkn uzumen tsutsatrakan e nrants bolor ararkner@ u khosker@.

Lav kliner ete duk patmeik indz dzer kinoi masin, syujei u npatak@

P.S.Dzer kardzikov lav chi lini Forumi mech steghdzel tema" Patmutyunner", vochte kartatsadz, ail pokr patmutyunner@ kyankum patahats???

Ete djvar che karoghek indz namak ugharkek dzer hasakov u mi kani khosk dzer masin

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Mne udivlyaet chto vi pitaetes' vilizat',visosat iz pal'tsa opredeleniya vsego i vsya, otvechaya na vopros, kakaya literatura khorosha, kakaya net,lyudi...

Lyuboe opredelenie i lyubaya misl, rano ili pozdno, ustarevayut, kak i veshi i oprovergayutsa, sledovotel'no, zachem nam zadavatsa tseyu davat' opredeleniya?

Vi govorili chto unformal haknvogh martik dzer hamah azat martkants chapanish che. Panki, rastomani, antiglabolisti, esli oni ne prosto podrajayut chemu-to, a realy belive vo chto-nibud', oni i est' khoroshie lyudi, pust' daje oni odevayutsa v lokhmotya i pakhnut neprilichno...

P.S. Na forume est' lubiteli Sistem of s down, Leonard Cohen, Ibragim Feres, Evora...???Otzovites'!!!

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Lav kliner ete duk patmeik indz dzer kinoi masin, syujei u npatak@

Ete djvar che karoghek indz namak ugharkek dzer hasakov u mi kani khosk dzer masin

Fadei,

chistn asats, yes patrast chem, et kinon nkaragrel, manavand forumum, kani vor ain kejanana yev yes aid amboxj@ kkortsnem. Again, ;) read between the lines.

It will seem silly. The right time and the right place are a key to almost everything.

Mi pokr, shat abstract u "complicated" tesaket/kartsiq:

Kaxvats nranits te inchi masin e diskusia texi unenum, yes geradasum em, chimanal indz het vichox/qnnarkox mardkanc masin. Batsatrem...

Yete ais tipi zruitsunner enk unenum, indz aveli hetakrkir e ZUT KARTSIK@ yev voch te kartsiki sepakanater@, kani vor bnutyunits, mardik "INCH@" toxats @nknum en "INCHUI" yetevits. Aisink, menk aveli shat kchporum enk, te inchu tvyal ban@ asvets, qan te inch asvets.

"Nu... on tak skazal, potomu chto... tyajeloe detstvo, derevyannye igrushki..."

"On tak skazal, potomu chto eshche ne sozrel, zeleny eshe."

"Potomu chto v Amerike jivet, poteryal nacionalnye cennosti..."

"On tak skazal, potomu, chto on globalist,... ili nacionalist" itd

To est, my nezamechaya uje "predvzyato" otnosimsya k mneniu drugix, nu priroda u nas takaya.

A kogda diskusia zakonchilas i my uslishali, prinyali, otvergli, ponyali, itd eto "CHTO", uje ne pomeshaet, a daje polezno uznat "POCHEMU". Kstati eto ne kasaetsya politicheskix, bytovyx i podobnyx diskusii.

Yete mi depkum yes artahaitem im kartsiq@ tvyal temai masin yev asem vor yes 16 tarekan em, u mi urish depkum yes artahaitem nuin kartsiq@, bayts asem, vor 50 tarekan em, da nuin dzevov chi @ndunvi.

Orinak yes shat em sirum kardal Deepak Chopra, amen inch@ chem @ndunum iharke, bayts anchap hetakrkir teoraner uni. Indz iroq xanagarum e ain past@, vor yes gitem, vor ink@ Hndkastanic e, vor ir asatsner@ himnvasts en ais te ain culturai vra. Yes shat kuzenai, aid bolor@ ir masin imanai, ir grker@ kardaluc HETO. :)

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Literaturan(graganutyun@) shat lain ararkae vor asel, gtnelov orinak detektivnery formulan, da tupikovi ughutyun e, kan shark "detektivner" vor djvare ankam asel detektiv, aveli shut psikhologicheski besstseler u nrank kartalov djvare tesnel formulai nerkautyun.

Hamadzain em, yes aveli shut @ndhanratsnelov, wanted to make a point, to get it across. Dzer berats orinakum, henc da kliner mi "criteria", LAV girk hamarelu hamar. It stands out of a crowd.

Orinachaputyun@ mi pokr sur ek @ntunum, kani vor hajakhaki handipumen martik, Lav martik vor dzer asatsy pes azaten, baits der ujegh chen dimatrel @ntunvats stereopipnerin. Aid pes martik skzbits spasumen chapahasutyan@ vorpesy mi pokr ankakhutyun dzer beren tsnoghnerits heto nrank aprumen tsnoghneri nakhatesats nrants hamar kyanki hatvats, amen rope chmoranalov vor na azate u Lavne.

@ntanrapes tsnoghneri nakhtesats kyanky hatvadze prdzume institut avarteluts heto,

Isk yete arden hasunatsel en, inknuruin en dardzel, bayts der "azat" chen?

Baits

-Artsek aid tariner@ chkodretsin azatamtutyun@ u lain mtki asparez? Aveli shut ayo, kan voch, kani vor kutakvats azatutyun@ mokhranum iz-za sueti suet-Grekh veliki

-Na heranume stipats orenknerits, apagaits u durse talis amen lav@ inch kutakveler mech@.

Azatutyn@ shat @ndarzak u voch orinachap gaxaparn e. Im azatutyn@ mi urishi hamar karox e bant tval, isk errordi hamar mi gorsh qaos.

Azatutyn@ partadir chi vor lini "Rebellious reaction to the existing world". There is no single person free of stereotypes and other subjective views given to us by the society.

It's the ability to overcome as many of them as possible and not feel bitter by doing so. If I have reached a certain degree of freedom and am still able to communicate and "survive" with my surrounding environment, then I' am able to combine the "routine" reality with my "ideal" freedom. Otherwise I am going to feel rejected and unfitted. I would have no other choice that “SEARCH” for those who are on the same page with me or I will suffocate in my own free world. Just the fact that I have to do that is an obstacle itself for a larger freedom.

Dzer asats kortsrats tariner@ @ndhakarak@ karox en ognel, haskanal, @ndunel kam ch@ndunel irenc stextsats “azatutyn@”.

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Chachanak don't warry I wouldn't to get to know you as a girl, boy, young, old, or prety :p ...

ughaki imanalov vor kez pataskhanume 10 tarekan :wow: andz@ es vsta karoghem hbartanal with your replys, if you are 77,38 years old it's a little stange :hm: to read as points of view as you've writen.

Batsi dranits ko asats@, vor menk hetakrkrvelov te ove, inche, inchu e moranumenk imest@ aveli bnoroshe Filmerin. Chem sirum kino erb du inkt gone 25% ches dodumivat' anum

Ya ne goryu jelanie isportit' chistuyu intelektualnuyu besedu glupimi ellementami chata

Your film, your private dream, your you, and only you and your ego :flower: .. Aisinkn Mi kich egoizm@ chi khangarum martun, kani vor ete uzumes hajoghutyan hasnel u uzumes vor kez siren du piti sovores inkt kez sirel, hargel. Baits ush te shut dzer film@ ete uni chakatagir irakananalu duk pity tsuts tak stsenarian(ete iharge gri arelek dzer zadumkek@) piti pashtpanek u sirek. Iharge ete da very Private information, himarutyun klini ktsel sovats gailerin hamegh patarner tarinerov medzatsrats gurgurats(hajogh bar cher) mtki.

On the other hand ete du ujeghes ainkan vor kez tsav chi patchary skhal meknabanum@ u skeptitssm@ urishnery, ches kortsni hetakrkrutyun@ ko "erekhai" handep u hnaravore aveli kamkt qarana kyank parkevel ko tesankarin

P.S. Ais or mekenaiov propki(traffic jam) meche kangnadzei, volorot pokr poghotsum moskva, mer kokhk@ toti toti mer nman galiser mi kisa gruzavik, sra varort@ kagnatsrets mekenan helav michits u ir mekenai hetevi mas@ kanav u tchishik arets, es zarmatsa ira bnakan, kareli asel antsutsadrakan u nuin jamanak estesvenii, varmunkits

Propken tevets 2 jam

erevi na teghyaker

......................

What do you think about this

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Chachanak don't warry I wouldn't to get to know you as a girl, boy, young, old, or prety :p ...

Ya ne goryu jelanie isportit' chistuyu intelektualnuyu besedu glupimi ellementami chata

:D I did not say that? Did I? :D

I was implying completely different argument.

I think you missed the point I was trying to make. It wasn't about me, it was about discovering an opinion regardless of the background of the person who expressed it. ;)

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Chka ashkharum grogh ov chi mtadze grel ainpes mi ban vor zarmatsni Ashkhar u darna haitni, harust.

Chachanak my words which prick up you, were only provocation in other to liven up the talk.

Hetakrkire mart@ ir hayrenik@ vor teghne hamarum???

kani vor es Hayem, baits hayastan chem bnakvum, u ais tari, inchpes asumen styudentner@, ekvatorne, aisinkn ughigh 10 tary es apretsi hayastan u nuin chep Russastani dashnutyun@. Es amen rope hamarelov indz hay gtelem dra patchar@ nra mech, vor es erejanik mangutyunem unetse hairenikum chnayadz erkrasharji platakneri foni vra. Baits dzer kardzikov inchne drtum voroshel azgutyun u @ntnrapes petke linel sahmanapagvats azgain rassail kashvi guyni sahmannerov. Ed amen@ ughaki ashkharagrakan yurahatkutyunneritse, orinak mer hayastanum mart haykagan mentalitet dzerk berum u ete nran kstsel tsnvats orits afrika na popuasnerits ovchmi banov chi tarbervi. Artsek petke prpur@ beranin asel es hayem, rusem, amerikaitsem...

Ete indz hartsnen du inch azges, iharge es kpataskhanem hay. Baits...

Es kuzenai imanai goyutsyun uni hay grogh, ov grume kam grele Pavichy, Markesi vojov?

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est' mnenie, chto vse chto s nami proiskhodit, krome ekzogennikh sobitii, mi sami nastraivaim sebya na eto, t.e. stoit tolko sebya vlubit' vo chto- nibud' poushi i posvetit' sebya bez strasy, v bezmyatejnosti samootrecheniya etomu i vozdastsa vam Bogom!

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Chka ashkharum grogh ov chi mtadze grel ainpes mi ban vor zarmatsni Ashkhar u darna haitni, harust.

Chachanak my words which prick up you, were only provocation in other to liven up the talk.

Hetakrkire mart@ ir hayrenik@ vor teghne hamarum???

kani vor es Hayem, baits hayastan chem bnakvum, u ais tari, inchpes asumen styudentner@, ekvatorne, aisinkn ughigh 10 tary es apretsi hayastan u nuin chep Russastani dashnutyun@. Es amen rope hamarelov indz hay gtelem dra patchar@ nra mech, vor es erejanik mangutyunem unetse hairenikum chnayadz erkrasharji platakneri foni vra. Baits dzer kardzikov inchne drtum voroshel azgutyun u @ntnrapes petke linel sahmanapagvats azgain rassail kashvi guyni sahmannerov. Ed amen@ ughaki ashkharagrakan yurahatkutyunneritse, orinak mer hayastanum mart haykagan mentalitet dzerk berum u ete nran kstsel tsnvats orits afrika na popuasnerits ovchmi banov chi tarbervi. Artsek petke prpur@ beranin asel es hayem, rusem, amerikaitsem...

Ete indz hartsnen du inch azges, iharge es kpataskhanem hay. Baits...

Yes dzer hartsi nman mi topic ei batsel, bayts kcherin hetakrkrets

http://forum.hayastan.com/index.php?showtopic=6557

Kardacek mazd-i patasxanner@

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Chachanak, chto kasaetsa "insuerens people" menya i pokhleshe nazivali smth like plebeistvo, Khotya chto-to v etom i est' ot plebeistva nelzya do kontsa utverjdat', chto eto vsego-lish gordost'. Bolshinsvo iz nas zadaetsa, vot uj takaya u nas cherta."Lopazutyun". Kak govorili velikie. Kak dumaete chto est' u armyan? Naprimer u anglichan- manufakturi, u irlandtsev-viski, u russkikh-vodka, krasivie devushki, frantsuzov-romantika...

-U armyan est' manery! Ne vajno khoroshie ili plokhie prosto manery!!!

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Chachanak, chto kasaetsa "insuerens people" menya i pokhleshe nazivali smth like plebeistvo, Khotya chto-to v etom i est' ot plebeistva nelzya do kontsa utverjdat', chto eto vsego-lish gordost'. Bolshinsvo iz nas zadaetsa, vot uj takaya u nas cherta."Lopazutyun". Kak govorili velikie. Kak dumaete chto est' u armyan? Naprimer u anglichan- manufakturi, u irlandtsev-viski, u russkikh-vodka, krasivie devushki, frantsuzov-romantika...

-U armyan est' manery! Ne vajno khoroshie ili plokhie prosto manery!!!

:) neujeli vy tak naivny? :) (v xoroshem smysle) :cool:

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