Essence
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Posts posted by Essence
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you really are the Turk & Marksist ?
i am marxist,leninist and trockist...But as i said before i am not typical communist..firstly i am freedomist democrat socialist.And we have a party that is named "Freedom and Solidarty Party" in Turkiye.i dont want or support a totalitarian goverment,becauses it causes bureaucratic dictatorships,like Stalin or Garbacov.And totalitarian state can be easily controlled by a class or a race( like Aristocrats,like Turks,Russians or Jews.)And very differences too.if you want to talk about it we can do it on msn. But yes i am mainly marxist.And in turkiye,there are classical communist party like "Communist Party Of Turkey"(Tkp),Emep etc.
My msn : mainessence@hotmail
Hi,Essence!Are really in Estonia? And you wonna talk about relation between armenians and turkish?
I live in Estonia to. So , we can meet and I shall explain you our position. cool.gif
Sadly no,but you can contact with me on Msn,if you want..
Essence muallim, where do you live? In which country?Essence, siz haradan (ne şehirden ya memleketten) yazısınız?from Istanbul,Turkiye.
Do you have a university education? If yes, in which country?Yes,i am student in Bogazici University(istanbul,Turkiye) and probably i will do my master in Cambridge university..
You don't know, that all turks are marxists since Kemal Ataturk promised bolshevik russia to participate in worldwide expansion of bolshevik revolution, the territories of Kars and Trapison, as well agreement about Naxichevan were presents to red brothers, who even paint their flag to RED color...is mustafa Kemal a bolshevik?Dont say this to any historion or a guy that has info about this,because they will laugh at you.Firstly he is a Turkish nationalist.And he is also a liberal.His policies were for improving Private Sector.And he said as " Communism must be destroyed,where it is seen." And you still call him as A Bolshevik?in Turkiye socialist voters are only about %10-20..And these votes are divided to many parties.And you call all Turks are marxists..this is foolishness. And Mustafa Kemal's Party are nationalist social democrat..Not marxist..As you dont know being a marxist was a reason for going jail for more than 10 years before 1985 in Turkiye.
Anyway I couldn't call as a friend the son of my father's killer.i didn kill anyone, i am sure from this.And i am not more responsible than any other people for this upsetting event..if you see me as an enemy,you will lose.i wont see anyone as enemy,that i dont know him/her completly..
What you propose with your anatolian republic is the same thing (turan).i said that it wont be based on any religion or nation..As they say,MY FRIEND, "Prejudice cannot see the things that are because it is always looking for things that aren't"
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There exists a country GERMANY, which has a responsibility as a whole Country, as a whole Nation.
Than,this is only about a name right?
you still dont answer why today German Nation should be more responsible than any other nation for the genocide.
the example that i gave,about grandad..Because of the family's last name,should grandchildren be more responsible?You cant really answer this question.
It really is funny to see, how your attempts to “save” TURKEY from its responsibility for the Genocides of Armenians, of the Pontic Greeks and of the Assyrians,Nope...I dont have a "try" like that.i only want to show truths..At least Turkish imperialist State is not really my state..Also Armenian dictatorship is not..
i take responsibility that how much a people should take.Not much not less.i condemn that two-sided massacre and let the souls free..
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Germans, too, are humans, and they, too, in some sense are responsible for the Genocide of native Americans… but the responsibility of the Germans for the Genocide of native Americans is not the same as the responsibility of Germany for the Holocaust…
Why?i really dont understand.Than Hitler could be an Armenian too..You think Germans are more responsible because of They are grandchildren of Nazis?This is foolishness my friend.Their ancestors can be Nazis but are they?This is the important question.Do they support that anti-humanistic things?For example,your grandad coulb be a mass-murderer.And he died before you were born.Does this make you,murderer?Or are you more responsible than other people for this?if yes,why?i really dont understand..Please explain this to me.
one of the most dangerous things after a crime is to cover the direct responsibility for the crime by some too general phrases… Responsibility for a crime need be properly understood for prevention of the crime in the future!Yes,the reason should be understood,objectively.And for Armenian-Turk two sided massacre's reason was nationalism and Russia's imperialism,basicly..We should understand,prevent and destory humanity's dark face..
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If we think from your view,than you are also responsible.You are responsible for what Hitler,What Talat what the other racist,anti-humanitirians did..Because all of this "men" are humans,as you.From your "race",humanity.
And dont forget sth.I didnt kill anyone or didnt defend killing..I dont defend that ideology or i dont support wars.. etc. etc. What some class did,cannot be generalized to Turkish people or to Humanity.Me and Turkish People arent responsible.How can be a human responsible,that happened out of his control and before he was born.Of course i condemn all type of this wildness,but i am not responsible of anything like that.
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I have no problem with Being A Turk..But you have serious problems about being a human..You know what my blood is human blood,but yours will be destroyed like your friends,Hitler,Mussoloni,Talat Pasa,Bush,Saron and the others...Something - like human blood that you have.
But i love the armenian people because i met lots of good them.And i love one of them.And the rest is not important..Like you racist people,it doesnt matter Armenian,Nazi,Turk etc. Your end will be same.
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You know what,here is full of Racists..And with your anti-humanist ideas,you dont deserve respect..i dont know why i am trying to explain you "peace"..Your ideas are very similiar with Enver And Talat Pasa..Difference is location,time and side..But it is the same thing..
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In front of this, any tries to "reunite" them in a one country is useless and considered as a imperialism, whatever name you give for it - Anatolian Federation or International Union of States....
imperialism?Nope..i will call it as Internationalism..i dont want to found a Islam,Turkish,Armenian nation.I want to found An Internationalist Socialist state,do u understand?
Being Crushed Nations of The World,Unite!!
that could show you the absence of HATE against turks.i dont wanna see any more hate.. i saw enough..
but most of armenians just do not like tuksOh,there is an expection..i have an armenian girlfriend.But stop,for you armenian can love only armenian,right?This is bullshit and racism..i love her,and she loves me.it is not being armenian or turkish..i love either turkish and armenian nations..if you are stucked in your nationalist and Diaspora's pressurestic ideology,it is your problem and lose..
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foolishness of nationalism and class wars as marx stated,shenyatsi..imperialist ottoman empire's last moves..
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Right..Every bad thing is accused by Turks..And Turks are monsters,evils,they come from hell....Pff !
if i find its turkish,i will read it..Btw maybe it is time for you to read Armenian Event from different views..
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Patriotism is a form of nationalism.Nationalist socialists try to show nationalism more moderate,so they call it as patriotism.The end of patriotism way is again nationalism.Of course you love your mainland.As i do too.But for you Armenian People's and Turkish People's benefits should be equal priority,at equal value for you.
And about your question;
Firstly i would recognize truely that "barbarian"..and i would understand that is not a nation,a party,a organization...
And Neither Armenians nor Turks were rich at 1915.And your economic situation wouldnt be much much much better than this.
As Turkish Socialist,we say we can live under a socialist state that is laic from every nation.That is called Anatolian Socialist Republic.it wont based on nation or race or language or culture.Will be multi-nation,culture state..But this is against ur nationalist policies right?I am offering you to live under same house,as we used to till 1915.And that house was not only yours,also ours..As you know..
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Oho, NEO-COMMUNISM - sounds like a new under which are trying to hide the ones who wants to build a big Turan, look at this Essence
Man,Turanist are nationalist and racists.And i said several times before.i am against all of nationalism forms(racism,patriotism...)
I dont feel like a Turk or from nother nation.What i feel is being human.How can i tell you with a way that u can understand..F.ck Turanists,f.ck turkish nationalists also armenian nationaslits,racists..Ok?
I'm not a nacionalist, but I'm patriot, and I'm communist... but! You think this way because your country hadn't such bad expirience as Armenia had... if Armenia now had all terrytorries that we had earlier, Armenia would be now very rich country, as Saudi Arabia.... because part of Iraq was before our land...and as we know Iraq has oil...But this is not the reason, I showed you a simple example... How do you think, if y had many children, and a big house, and if you was a rich person, and one day some barbarian came to you, took away all your riches, and if he destroyed your house, if you had seen all your children suffering and dying, and your wife disgraced... how would fell in that case? Of course you will hate those barbarians... it is another example, now I want to hear your answer
i wont answer these..But;
1.i am not a barbarian.
2.The past is past.if you think that places are still yours,than turkish nationalists will say that asia and middle east theirs too,or macedonia said the land on 3 continents is theirs.
3.A communist should be internationalist.But you are not..You are just stalinist..But i am trockist..And freedomist democrat socialist..
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So as I was afraiding, you do not respect a right of others to leave INDEPENDANTLY...
Very typical and know principal called imperialism.
Nope,if i didnt respect,i wouldnt support Kurd's Movement.Right?
But now,i dont support Pkk or Kongra-Gel..Because they became nationalist and racist terrorists..as Armenians..
As i said before,i would support an Armenian Internationalist socialist country.But in 1915,it was a nationalist,imperialist move not a freedomist or anti-imperialist move.
Very typical and know principal called imperialism with turkisch accent, as of you are ready to kill even your brother and sister, if she will deside to leave a house and do what he/she want and live with whom he/she want and not with the one, that family desided.Really,is this a story that your parent's scary TURK stories?This is demagogy..And this doesnt make any sense..Just a try to humiliate a nation..And i think none of nations should be humiliated..
If you will follow a history of osman empire, you will see, that Genocide of Armenians, Greeks, Aramians and other minorities in 20th century, organized from Turkisch goverment was nothing else than a last tries to keep the empire.Yeah,you are right.But not genocides,massacres.But this is not only Turk's history.This is humanity's dark history.
The fabrications like - armenians or greeks were themselfs guilty, as of they start to build independancy, make impossible a coexistance of turks thinking like you and armenians in same country, as of it shows that turks like you do not respect a right of others leave a common house and build their own one.It is not impossible.Ask an Armenian or Greek in Istanbul,Turkey.i can give their msn to you.We are best friend.And they are really more open-minded and humanist.
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vagan,
What you are talking about is Extreme - Nationalism and racism..As i am against Turkish Nationalist or Patriots,i will be against Armenian Nationalists or Patriots..
As a neo-communist, i want a world without races,with one language and many cultures.The capitalism and nationalism are the biggest obstacles..And i will fight against them..As i am saying we can live under a nation,that nation will be both Turks,Kurds,Armenians,Greeks,Whole The humanity...I think there will be some Armenian friends who can understand me..
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If you are "sad" from Armenian movement of independancy and call it stupid, then it is hopeless to discuss with you anything, as of you do not respect a right of others to live independantly and FREE.
I didnt support nationalist Armenian Nationalist movement of independancy.Because it wouldnt be different from Ittahat and Terrakki goverment style.We can prove this with Armenian Revenge Army in Southern Eastern Turkeey,after invasion of french.
And the way of that was completly false.How can u defend a way like that killing,destroying,burning... etc.
If that was a revoulationist move, i could consider it,but if it wasnt and if it was successfull,there would be one more nationalist country.And i think we can still live togetherly under a country that named Anatolian Republic.Humanism and internationalism based freedomist democrat country...
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Essence, of course you try to jystify you'r country.
This Turkish Goverment or State is not mine.It is only a capitalist nation and a puppet of America-Israel.And it serves only imperialism.Not to my people or humanity.
You wrote that armenian's first attacked kurd's and turk's... but this words are falsehood! Armenian people tryed to reinute their country, to bring freedom to their houses... Turks tortured armenian nation for many years, and then the day came, when armenian's decided to stand up and defence themselves...Nope,as i investigated and talked with that term armenian and turks..They say that they were living peacefully.Of course they had some difficulties.But especially after Tanzimat and Islahat Fermans,their conditions got better and better.They wanted to found a new nation because of nationalism.And as u know ottoman empire was not a nation based empire..Too Many Armenians and Greeks or other ones had offical jobs in state.Look i am not a fan of Ottomans...But please try to look some points objectively..There can be no reason for killing innocent people,burning and destroying villages..For both Turks and Armenians..We could be living peacfully today, if we and you didnt make mistake.But now we should accept our history and try to destroy wall between nations.With Armenian Diaspora's nationalist and racist policies(also they educated all people samely,from one prototype) or with this Nationalist Capitalist Turkish Goverment.We,the Armenian an Turkish People,should destroy the wall,than states will have to give up their imperialist policies.
if you want, read a book about west Armenian problem in 19-20 centuries...I read many , and just finished one..The author was George Jerjian..
This is an official turkisch propaganda and I leave it only to allow other forum members see, with which "versions" they could confront, if will try to discuss this topic with turks born and grown in Turkey - voterWhen you stop naming truths as propoganda,than we can succeed in making peace.
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Hi,i am a Turkish freedomist democratic socialist.Also i am an internationalist.I want to talk about armenian-turkish event with you.If you listen me without prejudice,we can reach to a point.Now lets get back to the 1915.
Ottaman Empire was in WW1.And Armenians,who are called until that date as "brothers", said that they would battle with Turks against Russia,england..And they joined ottoman army.They took rifles,uniforms from Ottoman Army and but they didnt use them to fight the common enemy,they used them to destroy unarmed Turkish Villages to found Armenian Country.They killed children,women and old men.Turkish soldiers entrust armenians to East Side of country..But they did massacares against Turks and Kurds.This is one side of coin.Now lets look at the other side of coin.
This is an official turkisch propaganda and I leave it only to allow other forum members see, with which "versions" they could confront, if will try to discuss this topic with turks born and grown in Turkey - voter
İttihat ve Terakki Party,which had racist policies,had a policy that stated anatolia should be only Turk's Motherland..(Without a doubt,The head of This party Enver Pasa and Talat pasa were racist.) And they found a reason to succeed this plan.Some Armenians(Not many of them) killed some Turks,be unfaithfull and now they should gone,he thought.(For a racist,this is a normal idea.)As you know,they enacted "Techir".And with this law,armenians would be sent to syria.But they a secret plan.They wanted to be sure that armenians wouldnt come back.And they ordered Teskilat-i Mahsusa(An agency like Fbi,Cia) to organize revenge attacks against Armenians.They released mad men,criminal men from jail;and organized them(Turkish and Kurdish Criminals) as guerillas to kill armenians.Without a doubt,this was a massacre too.
Armenians lost more people that Turks lost.But if there is one who lost, it is the humanity.And as a result,i think it is a two-sided massacre.Today,i am condemning Enver and Talat Pasa,also that criminals,and agency soldiers.But also i am condemning Armenians,who burned Turkish villages.
What i want to say is; as a Turk i can face the history.And i can condemn all that monsters.But you should realize of your :censored: by voter movements - warning because of insulting .Most Of Armenians,expect living in Turkiye,say that %90 percent of Turks are barbarian,monsters or evils.This is racism,this is the way to create new massacres.We are not monsters.If we were, we couldnt live peacefully with Armenians for centuries.You can generalize things.As Nietzche say,"All generalizations are false,like this one."
As a result,for me it is not important being an armenian or a turk or anthing else..What important is being human.And what i want to do is,destroying the walls between you and us.For these,i say lets condemn this two-sided massacres,give peace to that souls and forget our nationalist and racist policies.
Brootherhood of Nations,Cannot be obstructed...
Brootherhood Of Turks And Armenians
in Genocide
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it doesnt matter being armenian or turk.As i said before,as i am an internationalist i am Turk,Armenian ,Kurd,greek,German,Chinise,African...
http://www.greek-forum.com/forum/showthrea...946#post1611946